27. I Love the Turner Carroll Gallery: Michael and Tonya Turner Carroll

Episode Transcript

Bunny: (00:00)
Hi there. I’m Bunny Terry, and you’re listening to the I Love New Mexico podcast. Whether you’re a native new Mexican, who’s lived here for your entire life, or you’re just considering a visit, this episode is for you. Join us as we share a lot of New Mexico’s stories. Talk about all things New Mexico, and include topics like what’s magical here, where you ought to visit, what’s happening, and the things you absolutely cannot miss in the land of Enchantment. We’re excited that you’re here, and we can’t wait to show you what an amazing place New Mexico is, because let’s face it, I love New Mexico. I say this every time I do a podcast. I say, what an incredible gift it is that I get to meet so many people who are involved in New Mexico, who are, um, either recent transplants who have lived here for years, who maybe have moved away and are expats. I get to meet the coolest people in the world, and today is absolutely no exception. Today, my guests are Tanya Turner Carroll, and Michael Carol, who are the owners of the Turner Carroll Gallery. That’s kind of a mouthful for me, and, and, um, in Santa Fe. And one of the reasons we’re talking today is that they have an amazing artist coming to town. But I gotta tell you, you always have amazing artists. And I also have to tell you that I think your housed in the coolest space in Santa Fe . But, but before we start all of that, I’d like to hear how did, um, how did the two of you end up in New Mexico in the gallery business? I really wanna hear about that.

Michael: (01:59)
So, Tanya and I actually met in North Carolina in the theater, doing theater together. Both of us went to college there and I had just graduated and had hooked back up with a group that I worked with in New York and, and, Tanya found these guys. And so we were in this particular production that was about the surfaces of things. And so there were no words. It was, you know, proper performance. And we, we’ve fell in love during that, that process. And when Tanya graduated, we beat it out here. Uh, Tonya had an internship. I’ve had some family, and we both got jobs and we’re like, almost this go west amazing place. Maybe thought it would be all the way to San Francisco, but like a lot of people, we find ourselves here and have not left. Um, so we went back to North Carolina, quit our lives there, and moved out and, um, started working in, uh, for me in an allied industry. And then Tanya was running a gallery. And at night we rented this, well, we rented this building that we lived in, and at night we turned it into like a performance space. This is something not a lot of people know about, um, in

Tanya: (03:09)
19, and that was like in 1989.

Michael: (03:10)
89 90, yeah. Something like that. So by, uh, 91, we were able to get our space on, on Canyon Road through a very Santa Fe, uh, kind of set of circumstances. It wasn’t quite winning it in a card game, but it was real close . Um, and so, and so we launched the gallery at, at that point, and, you know, have been at that for I guess coming on 32 years now in, in June. Wow. Yeah. And as a function of the organic growth and running that gallery to you know, what We felt like we, we did everything we could out of that space, but, um, our dreams grew, the reputation of our artists grew, and of course, the size of the artworks grew at also. So it w it became clear that we needed, uh, another space, but a whole bunch of different things conspired to create container. And one of them was an experience I had trying to buy a beautiful little piece of, um, it was a needlepoint piece out of a nonprofit art space of unnamed storms hitting Puerto Rico. Like, I guess, you know, the part of the artist, Francis Guyardo is her name. Part of her story was that storms at Hit Puerto Rico, don’t even get names. Um, but nobody knew how to, how to sell me this little piece. And I was like, well, that’s, that’s ridiculous. And, um,

Tanya: (04:33)
And that was outta a museum show.

Michael: (04:35)
Yeah. And, and so there were a couple situations like that where a whole bunch of different things conspired to, um, for us to come up with this concept. And the idea was that it’s gonna fulfill a whole bunch of needs that weren’t being met in the, in the art world. One of them was, you know, having museum shows this are, you know, our artists moving around and we wanted to make a stop for them. We wanted to be an institution as opposed to a gallery also, to have that side, because that adds leverage to what we can do in the art world. It adds leverage to what we can do as collectors. You know, we have this dedicated space. Um, it’s, we can, you know, our ceilings are now 20 feet tall. We’ve got 4,000 square feet of exhibition space. And like you said, this building is made of shipping containers. It says, you know, we’re a contemporary space. So the name that we chose container was, was completely perfect in that it, the building is made of shipping containers. They’ve been all over the world. They’ve had these stories, and now they’re assembled into this vessel, right. That holds all of these different kinds of things that we’re trying to do. And one of the really interesting problems that, that we’re, uh, starting to solve is that private collections by big collectors who really wanna share their work, are stifled to a degree going into the, the museum world, because there’s a perceived conflict of interest with the exception of university museums. Well, we would love to have that material. Um, and, uh, the next show with Beverly, we’re gonna we will have a loan from a major collector in St. Louis. So that’s the, the insanely short version of what it is that we’re up to. But we’re having an enormous amount of fun. It’s already worked, uh, with a museum stop for swoon that’s gonna go now to a museum in Virginia. Wouldn’t have been possible had we not been able to mount that, uh, that show in our space. We’re beginning to develop programming around all the shows. We, uh, put in a residence there as well. And that will be part of a curatorial and artist, uh, grant operation that we will get, uh, running this year. So it’s a, it’s a big, big, big project and, um, we’re hoping, and, you know, really making partnerships with other institutions here in town to, you know, drive the conversation for this is something that, you know, as Tanya says, we would, we would do if we weren’t paid for it. You know this is our lives and, and how we wanna roll. So there you have it.

Bunny: (07:08)
Well, and you know, I’ve been in that building several times. I think I said this in the email, and I was in, you know, I was in there before when it was a retail space, and then I was there as a realtor because it was on the market for a little while. Yeah. And I kept dreaming that somebody incredibly, you know, I kept, I kept thinking, please don’t let somebody buy it and just use it as a residence because it’s such, it, I don’t know. The vibe is so, um, it’s so perfect for this town and for this time and for you to buy it and create a space for artists. It’s another one of those Santa Fe, one of those New Mexico stories where, um, life does exactly what it’s supposed to do, even when you didn’t expect it to do that. So, right. So thank you for doing that. It sounds like that’s sort of part of your story coming up.

Michael: (08:06)
Absolutely. Thank you for noticing. The building really itself is a, is an actor in this, in this process. And it’s, it’s, it’s a singular structure in Santa Fe, and it has a very, very big, uh, part to play and how our project was conceived. I don’t, you know, I don’t think we could have done this in a warehouse. It just, it not, it would not have been the same.

Bunny: (08:26)
Well, and you’re in the rail yard and I mean, it’s, it’s just, it’s just incredibly cool. So that, I mean, those are inadequate words, but I think those really are the words I want to use mm-hmm. . So, um, I always wanna be, be very aware that we have listeners who are, I, we probably have somebody in North Carolina who’s listening. Um, certainly we hope for that sort of an audience. And so I want folks to know that what we’re talking about today, in addition to your, um, to the amazing gallery and the life that you’ve built here, and the way that you’re supporting artists is that you have donated to help people in Northern New Mexico. The Cancer Foundation for New Mexico’s Sweetheart Auction, which is on the 11th of February, is a, the primary fundraiser for the organization that I am the board chair of. And, we help Northern New Mexicans get to the treatment that will save their lives. And we do that. The, the foundation does that by providing mileage reimbursements. I just did, I just looked, I just had somebody compile the numbers. For the last five years, we’ve provided over 2 million miles in mileage reimbursements. So you don’t have the gas to get to your treatment. We are gonna make sure that you can do it. We provide overnight stays. We provide grocery cards, support groups, which are incredibly important, and all the volunteers that work at the chemo suite. So you, I don’t know if you knew about the organization before, but what I do know is that when one of my board members said, you wanna donate something, you both jumped in with both feet. So I want to applaud you for that. Thank you for,

Michael: (10:11)
Thank you. We’ve actually been to several of the events with our friends, um, doctors Brian and Laura Goss in the past, so. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. They’re fantastic people.

Bunny: (10:27)
Well, thank you for this. And I want to hear from you, Tanya. I wanna hear what folks, what’s you’re offering, because it’s okay. It’s so cool. Tell us about Beverly and tell us about the offering.

Tanya: (10:39)
Okay. So Beverly McKeever is a black artist from a black female artist from North Carolina. She grew up in the projects, uh, in Greensboro. And, uh, she grew up about 10 years before I was born in, uh, North Carolina, about 25 minutes from where she grew up. But our upbringings were incredibly different. She was bused across town to the wealthy white neighborhood to go to high school. And, uh, she watched the KKK shoot a man outside her window. She, um, she had a mentally disabled sister, a single mom, yet she went on to win the Rome Prize. So she was a fellow at the American Academy in Rome. She went to graduate school for art at Penn State, where her advisors did not let her graduate on time because they were having a black student attrition problem. And so they asked, they paid her to stay another year kind of against her will, they wouldn’t give her the diploma or the graduate degree unless she stayed an additional year, at which point she met Faith Ringold, the amazing artist, faith Ringold, who is really a mentor for so many black artists, but a special friend and mentor for Beverly McKeever. So now the Smithsonian has purchased Beverly McKeever’s paintings. She’s in major museum collections and private collections throughout the country and the world. And, uh, she currently has a nationally touring retrospective that’s touring museums from coast to coast across the country. So when I found out that the Cancer Foundation Gala was going to be the same weekend as her opening at our gallery, her introductory opening in our gallery, I thought, and I, and also because I knew that her own mother had died of pancreatic cancer, that, um, that, you know, that would, that she probably would be willing to help. So I talked to Beverly about a particular series of paintings that she has done called Her Dear God series, and this, which I love. Wow, it’s so beautiful. It’s my favorite series of all of her work. And, uh, she started this series when Obama was elected president, and she didn’t know what to do except capture her, her joy and her hopes and her gratitude in a painting. So she did a self portrait where her eyes are closed and she’s slightly looking up, and she wrote in handwriting, dear God, today, Barack Obama was elected president of the United States, and how she wished her mother could be there to experience this day. So she went on every time she had a profound fear or a hope or something to be grateful for. Whenever the Spirit moved her, she would do an additional Dear God painting, most of which are exhibited in her current retrospective as well as the accompanying monograph. We are bringing one dear God, painting from that series to our retrospective in our gallery that people will be able to see and or actually have it on view during the Cancer Foundation gala, because Beverly has agreed to donate a Dear God painting experience to the winning bitter on that experience at the Cancer Foundation. And I do believe that people can bid on this painting even if they’re not there. Is that correct? Can they bid on property? Yes. Yes.

Bunny: (14:47)
Be, any of our live, and this is a live auction item. Um, we have 15 live auction items because we picked the absolute best of the best. Mm-hmm. . And, and this is, I mean, it’s not just a painting, it’s an experience. Yes. And so, um, yes, if there are collectors or people out there that would like to proxy bid, I, I’ll put a link on this podcast. Oh, perfect. Okay. So that people can proxy bid on, um, this experience. But yes, I mean, I know that there are people all over the country that would like to get their hands on something like this.

Tanya: (15:24)
So let me tell you a little bit more about the specifics of the package. So, um, what we’re offering is that Beverly and the curator of her nationally touring retrospective, whose name is Kim Bogani, who also actually, um, was the editor of the Monograph that accompanies the retrospective. They will both be in attendance at the Cancer Foundation dinner, so people will be able to meet them. We’ll have the dear God painting there for people to see. And what they’ll be bidding on is a very special luncheon that’s sponsored by Pearl Construction Pole, Pearl Builders who build some of the most incredible, um, homes right here in Santa Fe. They’re underwriting a luncheon that will include Beverly, the curator, myself, Michael, the Pearls, and the winning bid and their guests. And at the luncheon, a very special thing will happen. It’s a catered luncheon. I’ve seen the menu, it’s amazing. I think it’s a five course luncheon with wines and, and all sorts of delicious things. But during the luncheon, um, Beverly will do a painting specifically for the winning Bitter. So they shall do a Dear God painting as a prayer for them, just like she’s expressed her own prayers and hopes for herself and for society at large. But she will allow them to choose what is written as the prayer at the top of the painting. It’ll be a 30 by 30 inch painting, just like the others in her museum series. And, um, sh because she’ll be painting it during the luncheon live for the people to watch, so that all of their, um, good intentions and their own feelings can enter the painting as well. Uh, because she’s gonna be painting it there. It’ll be, it won’t be quite as, um, finished as the ones in the museum series. It’ll be what we call a fully executed oil sketch. And, um, it’ll be gorgeous. It’ll have a background. It’ll, it’ll be her self portrait. And then after the painting, she’s done the painting part, she’ll write their prayer on it. Now, if the, um, so the value for that, for that fully executed painting sketch is $25,000. Um, if the collector would like to have the painting taken all the way, um, to the extent of the paintings that are touring around the national retrospective, they can work that out with us as well. But she’ll have to paint on it a little bit more after the luncheon. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. But it’s gonna be just an incredible event.

Bunny: (18:31)
It is.

Tanya: (18:32)
Also, the curator will also say a few words about Beverly’s work and the Dear God series just for this private event.

Bunny: (18:41)
It’s so exciting. And, and it’s unlike anything, you know, people who come to the event are accustomed, um, to things like the Africa Calls Trip, which is an amazing trip. And they’re, you know, they’re accustomed to dinners at Saan and Ella, but we’ve never offered anything. That’s cool. I mean, hang on. I don’t wanna say that. I don’t want the other donors to think that, I don’t think their generosity is beyond belief, but this is so unique and it’s such a gift to collectors. And, I’m just telling you, I’m beside myself with it.

Michael: (19:17)
It’s, you know, it’s one thing to buy a painting and, and, you know, we’ve given to plenty of options as have mm-hmm. , you know, everybody else here. Um, but it’s another to know the artist to come with a story to after the fact, to have been a part of, you know, your amazing organization and the fact that this is gonna help people at the end it’s whoever the lucky person is, is, you know, I think is, it’s gonna be spectacular, you know, for that person’s heart and stories that, you know, can be told after the fact.

Bunny: (19:55)
I’m really excited about it. And I love that you’ve come before, you know what people don’t get, I think especially from elsewhere, from perhaps other states in the Union, is that New Mexico is home to amazing artists, um, and amazing people who, who support the art world in a myriad number of ways. But what people don’t get is that for a, a state that is considered somewhat economically depressed, this is without a doubt the most generous group of people I’ve ever been affiliated

Michael: (20:37)
With. No question.

Bunny: (20:39)
And, and I, um, you know, even 10 years ago at this time, I was in the middle of treatment for stage four colon cancer. Oh my gosh. And you’ve, I mean, you’ve, if you’ve been to the event, maybe, maybe you’ve heard me talk about that. And one of the things I’m gonna talk about when I’m on the stage this time is that 10 years ago, in 2013, I came to the Sweetheart auction and I was single, and I was in the middle of treatment, and I was waiting for a doctor to say whether I was even a candidate for surgery. And I came in the door and I, and I couldn’t, I mean, I really couldn’t afford a ticket, but I put it on my credit card, um, because I didn’t know what was gonna happen. I didn’t know if I was gonna be here in three months to pay my credit card bill. So sort of like, well I’m going . And I came in the door and, and I came, it was really this, I came in the door of that convention center, and I stood there and I thought, this is a group that deals in hope and possibility.

Tanya: (21:42)
Mm-hmm. .

Bunny: (21:43)
And it still kind of blows my mind that I get to lead the group that somehow my life, you know, I did survive, obviously, and somehow my life got to this place where I get to lead it. But it sounds, I mean, you guys, obviously the two of you deal in hope and possibility all the time for your artist. But it sounds like Beverly does too.

Tanya: (22:11)
Oh, Bunny Wait until you meet Beverly.

Michael: (22:14)
Wait till you later .

Bunny: (22:15)
Yeah. Wait is

Tanya: (22:17)
One of the most hilarious people on the planet. She actually when she was bused across, talk about hope and possibility, when she was bused across town to the white school she knew, she felt that she really didn’t fit in. So she went to clown class after school clown club. And at that point in time, the clown club members always all put on white makeup, and…

Michael: (22:47)
How wack is that? Right.

Bunny: (22:49)

Tanya: (22:50)
Yellow yarn Wigs. And so she loved being a clown because that’s when she felt like she fit in with all the white people that were in her school. So then she decided that she might make a career out of being a clown. So she was going to go and audition for Ringling Brothers, but then she found out that Ringling Brothers didn’t accept black people or women to be clowns, so she couldn’t even audition.

Michael: (23:16)
Yeah, I know. Like, I nowhere to put that in my head, .

Tanya: (23:21)
But she, but she is really hilarious, and she has all the expression and all the expressiveness that you’d expect from a clown. So, um, so when people meet her, I think they’ll really fall in love with her just like we did.

Bunny: (23:38)
Well, I can’t wait to meet her. Tell me about the events surrounding this particular opening. I know, are you, you doing, are there receptions that people can come to? Yes. What, how, how can they get in the doors of container?

Tanya: (23:52)
Okay. So they’re, we’re having a whole celebratory weekend for Beverly on February 10th, which is a Friday before the event for the Cancer Foundation on the 11th. We encourage everyone to come and see the scope of Beverly’s work at Turner Carroll Gallery on Canyon Road right across from Geronimo. That’s where we’re gonna have her retrospective. And that will take place from five to 7:00 PM on Friday night, on Saturday before the gala for the Cancer Foundation. Come over to Container at one o’clock and everyone can see the Dear God paintings that’ll be exhibited at Container. And they can also hear Kim Bogani speak, and they can get a copy of Beverly’s book. She’ll be doing a book signing then as well. So there are plenty of opportunities for people who might wanna bid on this item to come and see the full range of Beverly’s work to understand, um, the value of the work, the importance and her skill as a painter. Also, they can study up on her resume, um, because this, this item really is something not to be missed. I’m gonna have a hard time not buying it myself.

Bunny: (25:15)
Yeah, I know what you’re gonna say, . Yeah. I’m, I’m trying to think what I can move around so I can . Yeah. But, um, I, and I do think it’s, I, I mean, this is the coolest thing. Um, when I, when I talk about the generosity of new Mexicans, I mean, obviously she’s not a new Mexican, but offering to give, um, her time and her talent and her treasure and, and you doing the same thing to help people that I mean, I’m telling you, I don’t know who our patients are, and that’s as it should be. They are in, I would say, um, you know, other than the loss of a spouse or a child, that being diagnosed with cancer has got to be one of the worst experiences of anyone’s life. But, um, for somebody of her caliber to make this donation, and for somebody who has the success that you guys have to make this donation for people that you don’t even know for, for is, is, um, when you were talking about her original Dear God piece, the one where she said, dear God, today, Barack Obama was elect, it still gives, I have a chill.

Bunny: (26:33)
It raises goosebumps. I have goosebumps on the back of my neck because it’s, it’s, it just is all about hope and possibility. And that’s what you guys are giving away.

Tanya: (26:48)
And even though you know, you might not know who the patients are, we might not know. What I do know is that we’re all connected in that we’ve all had a close friend or family member who has been diagnosed with cancer. And so we’ve all been touched by that kind of, um, trauma.

Michael: (27:14)
And we lost a really, really dear friend of ours about a year and a half ago to pancreatic cancer. She wasn’t feeling well, she didn’t look good in April. And, um, we found out in July she had pancreatic cancer and she was dead in, what, four weeks or something. It was just devastating.

Tanya: (27:36)
And that’s who the Container space is dedicated to. It’s an artist named Hung Lou, who Beverly knew and loved. And, um, she’s the one that, um, that we kind of honor in purchasing container and the events that we do here. So it’s really fitting for us to honor her by giving a donation to the Cancer Foundation.

Bunny: (28:00)
Uh, thank you so much. I want, you know, when you said that, Michael, when you said that so many people are, were connected in this world of I spoke once at an event and I did a standup sit down and I said, you know, stand up if you are a native Santa Fe, you know, and stand up if you I had all these different instances of, you know, stand up if you listened to the Rolling Stones of the child. There were all these different instances. And then I said, stand up if anybody you love, if you or anybody you love has ever been touched by cancer. And there was not a soul in the room that sat down

Michael: (28:38)
Holy Smokes.

Bunny: (28:39)
And, and I don’t, I haven’t ever met anybody who could say never been connected to anybody who had cancer. So, so this is a, this is the club nobody wants to belong to, but we all belong, right? So we’ve all had an instance where somebody we care about or ourselves have, have, um, lived through this sort of, uh, trauma. So just want I so want people to find your events. I want them to be at e the gallery on Canyon Road Friday night. I’m coming and I’m gonna have on my work clothes because I’ll have set up all day long for the event. But I’m planning…

Tanya: (29:24)
Five, five o’clock February 10th at Turner Carroll Gallery, 7 25 Canyon Road, Saturday at Container 1226 Flagman Way in the Baca Street Rail yard at one o’clock.

Bunny: (29:41)
And then you can see the full range, meet Beverly and get ready to bid. And how long will this, how long will this exhibition last until March 10th. Yay. So if for some reason you’re not in town this weekend, uh, I’m sorry. Well, it’ll be this weekend. Um, if you’re not in town this weekend, to go to the events, get to Turner Carroll afterwards, if you would like to bid on the experience with the Turner Carroll Gallery and Container and Beverly Macyver. We’ll, there’s a link to that to proxy bidding on, um, that we’re going to post along with this. And, I think, we’ll, I think we’ll have, if it’s okay with you, and we can get the image, we’ll have a couple of, uh, Beverly’s images links to those as well. So I want people to know what you’re doing. I want them to know what Beverly’s doing, and I want ’em to know that you’re really helping us celebrate 20 years of saving lives in a big way. Well, thank you for the work that you do. Thank

Michael: (30:47)
You. And, and if anybody needs help with any kind of clarification, you can ring us and we’re happy to connect you to the right people and give you more details. We have a lot of information. Perfect.

Bunny: (31:01)
Great. Thank you for being here. And, um, I, let’s do this again. Next time you’re gonna do something fun. Let’s do that. Great. Thank you.